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Tropheus Breeding Discussion of Tropheus conditioning, breeding, venting/sexing, fry care and rearing.

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  #1  
Old 05-05-2015
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Default F1 Maswa from forum breeders.

With all the threads about Maswa, I thought I'd start this one. I would love to see pics of adult F1 from Mastiffman and TroPhish. Their WC colonies are some of the nicest I've seen and I just wonder how their fry turn out.

If you bought F1 from Mastiffman or TroPhish, please share pics of your colony...

Last edited by Trophaolic; 05-05-2015 at 04:05 AM.
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Old 05-05-2015
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This is great idea. I'd love to see some of my fry. I know that they won't be perfect but with the females that I currently have I betting there are some nice ones out there... And with the variation in the Maswa lines in general it all comes down to selective breeding.
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Old 05-06-2015
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If I'm not mistaken I have about 13-14 F2 from one of Trophis' WC colony. Got them from RRaptor. I will tell him about this thread and double check where he got his colony.
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Old 05-06-2015
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RRaptor did get a handful from me. I think he got 10-12 so I'm sure some of those that you have are from my group but he did have some Maswa that he added mine too. So they might be a mix of mine, his originals, and maybe even some fry he produced.
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Old 05-06-2015
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Hope they are doing well!
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Old 05-06-2015
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Let's see some pics of them...
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Old 05-07-2015
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Now I'm just being a realist here.... But unless fry were hand picked fry from a female or group of fish that are known to have consistency, I think that with any group of fry, Maswa will have be selectively bred.

Look at how close the collection points [basically] are consider that the history of the Maswa collection in the past. For there to be any in the lake, they would have had to cross breed with thinner striped Duboisi like Kigoma and Halembe and especially Karilani (white stripe) being so close. So more recently caught Maswa might very well be producing a wide variety of fry.

I'll be honest, I've not only seen it in early batches of my first fry (Had a less consistent group and male with thinner stripe than my current WC male), but very apparent in all naturally bred Maswa that I've come across.

I think that Pam Chins Maswa Group is one of the Best I've seen. But then again, IIRC, she's a made good choices with her breeding program of them. I don't think that she just puts any fry back into her colony. A good testament to what's possible and also realistic.

Looking forward to seeing some fish from my early colony.
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Old 05-07-2015
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Sent Thurgood a message last night. Seems like he may have a group of unchanged F2 fry that came from a F1 group of maswa that was partially made up of fish I produced. He got them from James (Rraptor) and I'll reach out to him to see if I can get a few pics of the group. Ill also contact a few other people that have gotten fry from me and see if they will post pics. Some should be coloring up by now.

Also, I agree with you Andrew.

What I'm noticing is that a very wide banded female does pass on a decent amount of the wide banded gene...but its not 100% consistent.

For the lack of a better way to explain it, I would surmise that in any wide banded Maswa, they are carriers of the narrow banded gene from previous generations and some narrow banded fry will be produced. Most likely some even with partial/broken bands.

Of course, starting with nice stock should help and will most likely increase your wide banded population with each successive generation, and while heavy line breeding may not be needed, no doubt some selection and guidance will be ascetically helpful.

In general I have learned that some in the group are quick changers and some are slower to change. The slower to change juveniles can look like they are not going to be anywhere near as nice as the faster changers in the group, but very slowly they improve... sometimes reaching the same level of quality as those early changers. Iv also seen the bands improve on fully grown adults with time.

As far as posting vids of fry my group has produced, I have a group of 20 fry I am raising off my group, however I dont think they would be a good cross section representation of the fry my group produces as they are off of one female and one male but I'll still post a video of them sometime soon.

Lastly, I do believe that Pam does indeed just put any fry back in. I think that she removes deformities and culls in that regard, but that she does not selectively breed and cull for any specific phenotypical traits. I'll reach out to her and ask. I could be wrong.

Anyway, duboisi are the coolest Tropheus in my opinion and I look forward to working with them for a long time.

John
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  #9  
Old 05-07-2015
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Sounds good and I will do the same. Although I didn't get a chance to sell many off of my first colony before they got what came in on the that last Pemba shipment. So after I knew all that was finished Ive since only sold one or two groups out of this current male.

I agree. Definitely seem to be some slow developing genes in the mix. Not sure why. Not sure at this point if that means anything in regards to quality.

But you hit it on the head and this is what I said from the get go. I was sent a couple WC that still had a few light dots and not full striping yet. I've seen stripes with black still almost right down the center clear up completely. Totally gone now. I've also seen nice wide stripes as Juvies, fade and get choppy and even wedge like, they closer they became to adults.

It's gonna be long for the Maswa, among others. But I think that with focus and putting differences aside together the community will see a change in the quality of Maswa Available here in the USA. They were literally one of the first Tropheus I owned and raised so I'm hooked for life. Like I've said before, I love all Tropheus and think that they are all beautifully unique in the own way but what I have now are my Favorites fro life for sure. Although I'm not quite sure that I have all of my favorites at this point.

P.S. I have contacted one person that may still own a batch of 40 from my first collected group (different Male) and 1 Person that took home a batch last fall from this current (left over) group with a different male. SO Hopefully I'll get some good news back on their progress. As you have mentioned John, I also have about 16 that I've kept from this current groups alpha male and best female. There's one more young female that is nearly identical in quality by about .5-1 full scale width That I plan on keeping a batch of fry from as well from this current male. So fun times ahead.
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