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MattB 08-01-2014 11:40 PM

48x24x20 100gal planning
 
So like stated in the welcome section I have a 48x24x20 100gal tank that I am converting from discus to Tropheus. I'll outline the basic plan here and let you experts pick it apart and help me out.

Tank: 48x24x20 Rimless 100gal
Lights: LED
Filtration: I need some help here. My first thought was go for something easy like 2 Aquaclear 110s (or 70s?) the only thing holding me back is the noise and the fact that i have 2 Ehiem 2217 sitting dry not being used. I just hate canister filters. The cleaning, the priming, the waste that gets trapped, the waste that shoots back into the tank from the hose after you clean them. The only thing I like about canisters is you can put inline heaters in. I might use them to start and just replace them down the line, saves me some money to start. Suggestions? My plan is to do weekly water changes so I don't need to go filter crazy.

Substrate: What do you suggest? I think my only two options I've limited myself to is a real white sand or some sort of plain old Aragonite special grade. I think I've read both work, was just leaning towards the Aragonite to give me a little extra buffer since I'm graced with more south american water than african water.

Fish: The big question. How big of a colony should I maintain in this tank? If buying tank bred juvis how many do you buy to end up with a colony? I'm not afraid of water changes after all, coming from discus. Tropheus seem like a vacation water wise :bowdown::bowdown:. Looking at different pictures I seem to of narrowed down my choice of fish to these varieties. Hard part will be deciding which to choose:
  • Tropheus moorii Kasanga Red Rainbow
  • Tropheus moorii Ilangi Nkamba Bay
  • Tropheus Sp. Black Bulu Point
  • Tropheus sp Black Pemba
  • Tropheus moorii Kasakalawe

Whats your recommended way to add the fish, say if you can only get half a colony from the seller/vendor, can you get another half and add a little down the road (same size)? Or is it better just to search and get them all at once?

Sorry about the long post, just excited and want to be prepared! If I miss anything please just toss it in. I'm sure more questions will find their way here. For now I'm going to read some older posts!

Cichlid Lips 08-02-2014 02:10 AM

What is the main goal of your setup?

Are you planning to breed? Wanting a community tank?

They say 12 to 15 of each specie for a colony, and if your in to breeding getting them from several places can be a good thing. Others will get 15 of the same group but that's the number a lot of guys go with minimum.

Then there is the decision, do I go with wild caught, F1's, F2's and so on?

For me it is more about the look of the fish over whether it is Wild ,F1, etc etc, but others have to have wild. As far as types, can't say I ever met a Troph I didn't like.

Different strokes and all that jazz.

I've always been a proponent of getting all of the fish as quickly as possible and raising them from fry/juvies. [For community tanks] I never had any luck adding fish after they have some size to them, and have a couple of Bemba's now at 2" that already need an attitude adjustment.
:evil:

It can be done but for a lot it means completely redoing the aquascape to change up territories and lesson aggression. Others suggest to have few hiding spots and loading the tank with high numbers of fish to lesson fish being singled out.

So long as you stay on top of those weekly water changes I think you'd be fine with a couple of groups of 15, but for sure would need to cut down their numbers as time goes on.

As far as filtration, think over filtering. :mrgreen:
These guys will require the water to be as pristine as the Discus required, and they don't like change at all. More about staying consistent so do what works for you that's easy and cost effective.

Looking at your list, pretty sure all of those are being worked on here, and what's not here the vendors can get ya.
:thumbsup:

Hope that helps a little.

MattB 08-02-2014 02:54 AM

Thanks.

It doesn't matter to much about Wild, F1, F2, etc. I want quality, good looking fish is what it boils down to. If I have to grow them up then I have no problems with it. I would like to breed, I think I want to successfully keep first but breeding is an eventual goal with this.

ExReefer 08-02-2014 10:05 AM

One correction on the above only because I used to keep discus. Tropheus do not require the same water quality as discus. With discus, daily water changes are very much preferred for healthy, thriving discus. I got away with water changes every other day on my discus tanks, but I was pushing my luck.

Trophs will do well with one large (50%+) water change per week. You could sneak in one more water change mid-week to ramp up breeding, but I find mine still spawn with once per week. The biggest reason why is because of the feedings. Trophs eat far less food and food with low protein content. The water stays cleaner longer. I only feed my groups twice a day. Most discus keepers feed 4-6 times per day and tend to overfeed because they know they are doing daily water changes. This is reason I left the discus hobby. The water changes are brutal and there is no way around them with discus.

Matt, my biggest piece of advice to you with trophs has to do with feeding. Less is more with this fish. Like discus, they will always act like they are starving, but don't take the bait as it will lead to problems. I found that very hard to control after coming from the discus feeding mindset.

gw12269 08-02-2014 10:41 AM

You would be fine with your 2 Eheims to start out or as a permanent solution.

As for substrate, I really like the Caribea Sea Special Seaflor grade argonite. It buffers my water to 8.2. The white color helps with the coloration of my Trophs also.

Lots of different Troph fry available rom members on here. Quality fish. I wouldnt keep more than 2 variants in your tank. Maybe go with a Moorii and an sp. Black. The sp blacks will out breed your Moorii.

MattB 08-02-2014 01:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ExReefer (Post 217673)
One correction on the above only because I used to keep discus. Tropheus do not require the same water quality as discus. With discus, daily water changes are very much preferred for healthy, thriving discus. I got away with water changes every other day on my discus tanks, but I was pushing my luck.

Trophs will do well with one large (50%+) water change per week. You could sneak in one more water change mid-week to ramp up breeding, but I find mine still spawn with once per week. The biggest reason why is because of the feedings. Trophs eat far less food and food with low protein content. The water stays cleaner longer. I only feed my groups twice a day. Most discus keepers feed 4-6 times per day and tend to overfeed because they know they are doing daily water changes. This is reason I left the discus hobby. The water changes are brutal and there is no way around them with discus.

Matt, my biggest piece of advice to you with trophs has to do with feeding. Less is more with this fish. Like discus, they will always act like they are starving, but don't take the bait as it will lead to problems. I found that very hard to control after coming from the discus feeding mindset.

Thanks. This will be a change in habit. I'll have to remember discus eat more, and can eat more due to a high protein diet and a warmer environment making the metabolism faster.

Quote:

Originally Posted by gw12269 (Post 217674)
You would be fine with your 2 Eheims to start out or as a permanent solution.

As for substrate, I really like the Caribea Sea Special Seaflor grade argonite. It buffers my water to 8.2. The white color helps with the coloration of my Trophs also.

Lots of different Troph fry available rom members on here. Quality fish. I wouldnt keep more than 2 variants in your tank. Maybe go with a Moorii and an sp. Black. The sp blacks will out breed your Moorii.

Thanks. I'll probably pick one variant and do more of a species tank than trying for 2. Problem is deciding which one! And I probably should go Aragonite to give me added benefit of the buffer. I have to re-calibrate my meter when the reagents come this week but last reading I remember from my tap came out at about 7.2 pH so bumping it up a bit couldn't hurt.

Another question. Aquascaping wise I want it to be very light, no big structures or caves or anything. Do you prefer rock piles? I've heard males control these. So If I have 2 rockpiles in the tank are any other males screwed or will they just fall back to subdominant? Do you suggest aquascaping another way?

ExReefer 08-02-2014 02:40 PM

A one species tank is the way to good. Good choice. It is very tough to decide which troph to go with and that's why many of us keep multiple troph tanks. :)

I prefer two rock piles on opposite ends of the tank. In a four tank, I have found that one male will still likely control the tank. In my six foot tank, I have seen two dominate males. Yes, the extra males will become punching bags, but that is the way it works and why large colonies are suggested.

MattB 08-04-2014 03:17 AM

Just calibrated my meter, pH out of the tap is stable at 7. After being aerated overnight it holds steady at 6.9. So its low which I will buffer, but the good news is it doesn't fluctuate hardly any.

noddy 08-04-2014 08:28 AM

What is your k.h? I buffer with baking soda to adjust my low kh.
I would buy 24 F1 Kasakalawe and run the two 2217's on the tank. They say that Ikola and Kasakalawe are the two types of trophs that show a consistant colour within the group. I can personally say this is true for the Kasakalawe.

MattB 08-04-2014 01:10 PM

KH and GH will be my next tests. Though most test kits are crap for them so I guess I'll just get a general idea.


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